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SNCF Monogram


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#1 John Udics

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Posted 19 January 2015 - 02:08 PM

Hello World Rail Fans!

 

I would like to know about the SNCF monograms. I guess that in era 2, there was a circular monogram pre-dating the lozenge, maybe pre-dating the all-letters immatriculation on the left end of the passenger cars. The circular monogram was on the side of the passenger car, but in the center. It was on the car the first time I ever rode on the SNCF. The cars were all green, with black roofs, I think. The monogram was painted on in an orange gold color.

 

It's a simple enough question, but I don't know anywhere else I can ask it!



#2 Jan-Martin Hertzsch

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 02:40 PM

The French Wikipedia article on "Histoire de la SNCF" says that the first logo (the one that you describe) was introduced in 1938 when SNCF was founded. It remained in use on rolling stock for a long time, Wikimedia Commons has images of locomotives taken in the 1980s, where it still had not been replaced, even though the "lozenge" had been introduced in 1972.

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#3 John Udics

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 04:08 PM

Thank you!



#4 John Udics

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 07:01 AM

If it is true that this monogram (sigle rond) lasted from 1938 to the 1980s, you'd think there'd be models in this livery. Some models, at least. The all-letters and numbers registration on the lower left corner of the passenger car side is plentiful, but the addition of the round monogram is rare. But - maybe there's little or no call for it.

Even if there are few cars with the round monogram, you'd think that decal sheets would have the monogram as an option.

I was happy to find one 'thunder-box' with this round monogram - on eBay.

It's not a problem.



#5 Andy Hayter

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Posted 10 February 2015 - 06:03 AM

John

 

The monogram (I assume you mean the macaron) on coach sides lasted for quite a short period - I will need to check exactly when.  This is in contrast to its use on locomotives.

There is significant confusion over the logos since the official logos (as used on letterheads) did not always coincide with their use/application on rolling stock. 

From memory (failing!) the macaron was used on coaching from the late 60s - well after it ceased to be their official logo on letterheads - until the introduction of UIC numbering - early 70s?

Relatively few items of stock then received the logo.

Prior to that the coaches just had the small SNCF letters above the running numbers at one end. 


Andy

#6 Andy Hayter

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Posted 10 February 2015 - 06:37 AM

www.lsmodels.com/Pages/General_F/Articles_F.htm


Andy

#7 vazonov11

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Posted 12 September 2015 - 06:42 AM

да, с логотипами есть споры.



#8 John Udics

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 01:38 PM

Это хорошо, чтобы знать, что у меня есть почти мировую поддержку и друзей !

 

It's good to know that I have almost world-wide support and friends!



#9 Andy Hayter

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Posted 24 October 2015 - 11:46 AM

I have just seen the first review of the REE UIC coaches in this livery - someone was listening to your requests John.

 

You will need to be quick though.  The ones with the macaron livery are already sold out at REE - but not necessarily at the shops. 


Andy

#10 John Udics

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Posted 09 November 2015 - 10:06 AM

Thanks, Andy, for the heads up. But it seems that whenever a new product is released, that's the time my finances are less than sterling. I checked my files and counted the number of cars with the round logo and see that I have a few. The REE models would have been nice, but - maybe next time...



#11 Andy Hayter

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Posted 17 November 2015 - 08:57 PM

If they have sold out that quickly at REE, I think we can expect a follow on run next year. 

 

You have my sympathies regarding financial planning for model items that may or may not appear at any time so. time to put a few dollars into the piggy bank each month in the hope of a re-release.


Andy

#12 John Udics

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Posted 18 November 2015 - 02:15 PM

Alsace-Lorraine and the EST

Is the AL a railway which has 'right hand drive'? That is, does the train travel on the right track or the left? I get confused as I think trains in Alsace were on the right, while trains on the EST were on the left - necessitating the saut de mouton crossover. Andy - you'd know, as a specialist in things SNCFical.

 

And how do I start this as a new topic?



#13 Andy Hayter

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Posted 29 November 2015 - 08:59 PM

Hi John

 

Yes you are quite correct, the AL was/is still right hand drive.  The rest of France is left had drive.

 

Many of the early French railways were built and often financed by British engineers and financiers and were built and designed to British standards - left hand drive.

 

Following the Franco-Prussian war (1970/1) Alsace and Lorraine were ceded to Prussia, who developed the railways on German standards and right hand drive.  [Does anyone know why German railways developed as right hand drive? apart from the obvious that this followed the operations of the road network].

 

After World War 1, Alsace and Lorraine returned to French control, but by then the infrastructure was so developed that right hand running continued and continues.  Connections to the Est network (today the rest of SNCF/RFF) often had flyovers to get trains running back on the right (or is that left) side.


Andy

#14 John Udics

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Posted 02 December 2015 - 12:53 AM

Thank you Andy. I'm glad that my mind is still functioning on some level and that you're there to confirm my thoughts.






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